Talk:Rail travel in Great Britain Voyage Tips and guide

Hello, thanks for the clicking the discussion. I have taken the step of creating this page because I have received a number of comments from Hospitality Club visitors and a number of questions from Wikivoyagers about my area of knoweledge - the UK's train system. I feel it is worthy of its own topic page because of the confusion caused by different (and often competing) train companies. Please allow me to start this stub and welcome your contributions before it is considered for deletion or relocation. Thanks (WT-en) Jamesbrownontheroad 05:35, 28 January 2009 (EST)

Ah, the good old British rail network... The number of hours I spend on it :) Will do my best to help with this page as I agree it can be confusing! (WT-en) Nrms 05:38, 28 January 2009 (EST)

Although I've been one of the dominant contributors to this page, I hope that the rating of "guide" is accurate. I'd appreciate other user's input, especially if you feel that rating is not accurate. I've tried to follow the Wikivoyage rating guide for travel topics. (WT-en) Jamesbrownontheroad 12:27, 3 March 2009 (EST)

It seems to me that this is at guide-status; it's a very complete and well-written article. --(WT-en) Peter ^Talk 15:35, 3 March 2009 (EST)

I enjoyed reading the article, and it is very comprehensive. One suggestion for improvement - are the wikilinks to the London airport stations, the best things to link to, I would probably expect to click on them and get a link to the airport info? --(WT-en) Inas 16:26, 5 March 2009 (EST)

Great article - the rail network in this country can be confusing enough for those of us that live here! Well done. (WT-en) Tarr3n 04:00, 29 April 2009 (EDT)

In this edit [1] my change was reverted. The original author proposes that you can actually purchase split tickets on one train to obtain a cheaper price, as long as the train stops at that station. The text then goes onto say there is a risk in missing the second train - but there is no second train involved in the strategy. --Inas (talk) 01:09, 6 August 2013 (UTC)Reply

Is this the edit you're referring to: where I corrected two external link formats and tried to make things clearer?

I rejected your new wording because it gave a probably false hope to folks that they might be able to rescue the situation with a "train manager" and I thought the phrase "...this strategy carries risk if you book the two tickets separate tickets on separate trains, and one of them runs late causing you to miss the other..." less than clear.

I also did not understand either the previous (or my current) wording to mean: " i think the person proposing the split ticket strategy is saying to buy them for the one train - therefore no risk." as you stated in your edit summary. A "Split ticket strategy" means that you buy more than one ticket for more than one ticketed (but connecting) journey for one - or more than one - train, doesn't it? If I'm wrong just change things the way you want it, Inas. --W. Frank^e-mail_talk 01:30, 6 August 2013 (UTC)Reply

Two points. Firstly, the whole discussion in the previous para about the train stopping at the station you buy a ticket to only makes sense for a single train, so although the strategy may be valid for two trains, the current text doesn't say that. Secondly, even in the case of two trains, the experience of people posting on the interwebs is that the train manager will allow boarding in the case of a delayed service causing a missed connection. I haven't seen a contrary account. --Inas (talk) 03:18, 6 August 2013 (UTC)Reply

That's the sort of result you get on a wiki; yes, the example given in the previous paragraphs speaks about a one train example of relatively short distance. However, longer journeys may require two or more separate trains. My personal experience is of the sadistic delight taken by ticket inspectors when they fleece you while muttering all the while "that's the risk you take when you try and buck the system". Anyway, hopefully the wording is clearer now. --W. Frank^e-mail_talk 03:25, 6 August 2013 (UTC)Reply

When I booked a single train trip which involves two train companies it gives me two entirely different tickets on the booking, even though it is one reservation. I just ended up in much the same situation as this, missing the train due to delay and catching the next one. After speaking with the train manager he accepted the advance purchase non-refundable ticket for the previous train, "just because today is a day with a 'y' in it". I'm not familiar enough with UK trains to really make a point of this. Of course, rules are rules, and if you game the system or buy a non-refundable ticket then you take your chances, and we have to make this clear. However, dropping a hint that it seems to be very much at the discretion of the train manager, who in my one and only experience, and in the experience of others may be willing to oblige if you look sufficiently humble and smile? --Inas (talk) 04:55, 14 August 2013 (UTC)Reply

Can I suggest that the rolling stock section is shortened (with links to Wikipedia?) as most of the info here is quite specialist and not necessarily of use to travellers. —The preceding comment was added by Crookesmoor (talk • contribs)

I think I do agree - it's a bit extensive perhaps. Please feel free to cut it down as you see fit! --Nick ^talk 15:05, 20 January 2015 (UTC)Reply

Sure, but without any separate links to Wikipedia articles. How much to link to Wikipedia is still under debate on this site, but to date, all we've achieved consensus on is a single link at the end of the article on the same topic as the Wikivoyage article, which appears in the sidebar on the left side of the page under "Related sites." Ikan Kekek (talk) 15:13, 20 January 2015 (UTC)Reply

Since it only covers England, Scotland and Wales? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 00:40, 23 June 2015 (UTC)Reply

That sounds like a good idea. The only possible issue I can think of, is whether it woud complicate and confuse the distinction between the UK, GB and the individual nations for someone unfamiliar with the country. --Nick ^talk 23:10, 25 June 2015 (UTC)Reply

Hi Nick. Yes, I thought that might be an issue too, but it may just be a question of having confidence in the intelligence of our readers. The paragraph starting in "This guide does not cover rail travel in Northern Ireland..." could be cut down and bumped up to the top in Italics. --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 00:11, 26 June 2015 (UTC)Reply

Sounds like a good solution - I'm all for this :) --Nick ^talk 00:25, 26 June 2015 (UTC)Reply

Now this article is already rated as "guide", but it seems to me that compared to some other articles featured as FTT it still has a lot of bullet points and a bit of a lack of direction... What do you think? What should still be done before featuring? Hobbitschuster (talk) 15:47, 10 August 2017 (UTC)Reply

Yeah, this one has been on my list of possible FTT candidates for a while. It does have a lot of bullet points, as you said. There's a great deal of information in the article, so probably everything relevant is covered. I haven't read it in detail, so I can't tell how logically arranged (ie. user friendly) the article is as of now. Also, the article needs to be up to date as per when it will go live. ϒpsilon (talk) 18:03, 10 August 2017 (UTC)Reply

I was wondering if this article should have a section on which train operators still have dining cars and proper meals options instead of the pre-pack sandwich "shop" option, which seems to be more common with more recent passenger rolling stock.

Some mid to long distance services used to have a refreshments trolley, if they didn't have a full buffet car. Not sure if this still the case...

Options in stations vary considerably, but I don't think there are any formalised "Station Buffet" now run by TOC's directly.

ShakespeareFan00 (talk) 19:20, 27 January 2019 (UTC)Reply

None of the main UK train operators have dining cars with waiter service. The last one was on the East Coast line which was withdrawn about 5 years ago. Larger long distance trains (LNER, Virgin Cross country etc) have buffet cars with limited hot food, hot and cold drinks and a range of sandwiches. The Caledonian Sleeper has a lounge car (bar). Medium distance trains usually have a trolley with sandwiches and hot drinks. First class tickets often include some at seat food or drink - on a 2 hour Virgin journey I got a beer and a bowl of soup.

Stations generally have one or more bland fast food outlets, the Pumpkin chain is common. However there are some rural stations that have good local cafes which attract people who aren't catching a train. AlasdairW (talk) 22:39, 27 January 2019 (UTC)Reply

Any objections to me adapting the above for a paragraph in the page? ShakespeareFan00 (talk) 17:46, 29 January 2019 (UTC)Reply

Of course not. It's a good proposal.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 21:11, 29 January 2019 (UTC)Reply

Go ahead - one small correction - Cross country now have a trolley, not a buffet car. AlasdairW (talk) 21:31, 29 January 2019 (UTC)Reply

This page has been nominated for FTT in Sep 2025. What work is needed on it?

Imagine you’re a visitor from North America, you might never have used a train before, and you land on this page. It’s comprehensive but voluminous and daunting, making rail travel seem ever-so-complex. You could book a car rental at your arrival airport in less time than it takes to read all this, and that will feel like your safe and simple choice.

So for starters IMO we need an introductory section that describes the system in a nutshell, and helps navigate what follows.

Those following sections should then be re-appraised in the spirit of ttcf: this page is about rail travel in GB. Descriptions of companies, rolling stock, history etc are relevant insofar as they support that primary aim.

Does this approach seem helpful? Grahamsands (talk) 14:39, 28 March 2025 (UTC)Reply

No objections, so I've added that as "How it works". Inevitably at this point there's disjoint with other sections, which will fall into place as those get sorted out.

To take one example, the transfers between air, sea and train. This sort of detail belongs on the relevant city page, so a background task is to check that it is. Once that's sorted, the section here can condense. It will also be relevant to mention major ports where you have no convenient transfer. Grahamsands (talk) 13:51, 1 April 2025 (UTC)Reply

The history discussion in the lead should be merged into Historical background, with only a sentence or a few left. Now there is more or less two long paragraphs of it, one short paragraph would be enough. A similar amount of text should be moved to Understand, which isn't there. The lead should be less than half a page (with newspaper-like line length). –LPfi (talk) 08:23, 2 April 2025 (UTC)Reply

Thanks for the How it works section – it looks good! –LPfi (talk) 08:23, 2 April 2025 (UTC)Reply

Agree, the ledes of most "Rail travel in - " pages are far too long and this one especially; I like the upbeat style of "RT in France". However I'll defer work on lede and background until the practical sections are on point. Grahamsands (talk) 19:51, 3 April 2025 (UTC)Reply

I’ve separated “International” from airports / seaports because the latter also applies to domestic changes of transport mode.

Check of the port pages is whirring in the background and as those are completed, that section is condensing piecemeal. It might look a bit skew-whiff while work is in progress. Grahamsands (talk) 21:03, 6 April 2025 (UTC)Reply

The "Planning " section was wordy but missed relevant information. It's been folded into "Buying tickets". GS 13 April 2025

Nearly there. The page is pretty much ready to feature as FTT. For my taste there's still a bit much on rolling stock and on corporate structure, and a few patches of garbled English. But I've reached the point where I can no longer read it afresh with unjaded eyes, so it's best if others do the final polish. I've also alerted the Rail 200 publicity folk that WV is on board with the anniversary. 27 Sept might be a good moment for a political announcement on next steps with the railways, so let's listen out. Grahamsands (talk) 19:09, 20 August 2025 (UTC)Reply

Hi all, I'd like to bring to your attention the inevitable nationalisation of UK rail companies.

Nationalisation of UK railways began in 2025 and is expected to finish by October 2027, following the Passenger Railway Services (Public Ownership) Act 2024, which allows the government to bring train operators into public ownership as their contracts expire. South Western Railway was the first operator scheduled for nationalisation in May 2025, followed by c2c and Greater Anglia, with subsequent operators being nationalised approximately every three months. By the end of 2027, all major DfT-contracted passenger services will be publicly owned.

The Railways Bill, introduced in November 2025, establishes Great British Railways (GBR) as a single public body responsible for both infrastructure and passenger services.

• Already public sector
  • LNER
  • Northern
  • Southeastern
  • TransPennine Express
  • ScotRail
  • Transport for Wales Rail
• South Western Railway (SWR), May 25 2025
• c2c, July 20 2025
• Greater Anglia, October 12 2025
• MORE
  • West Midlands Trains (includes West Midlands Railway and London Northwestern Railway), February 1 2026
  • Govia Thameslink Railway (includes Gatwick Express, Great Northern, Southern and Thameslink), May 31 2026
  • Chiltern Railways, TBC (expected summer 2026)
  • Great Western Railways, TBC (expected by autumn 2026)
  • East Midlands Railway, TBC (expected late 2026)
  • Avanti West Coast, TBC (expected in spring 2027)
  • CrossCountry, TBC (expected autumn 2027)

Can we enable updating over the next few years of this article?

Thanks,

Globetrotter30 (talk) 14:06, 9 May 2026 (UTC)Reply

Are you saying updating is disabled? Is there any impediment to it? This isn't usually the kind of thing that needs a Request for comment. What if any practical effects would it have on passengers, though? Ikan Kekek (talk) 15:31, 9 May 2026 (UTC)Reply

I think there is little practical effect at the moment, but some changes may come later. LNER has been government owned since 2018. The Scottish Government has recently made Anytime tickets the same price as Off-Peak ones, which may have been easier to do with a nationalised operator but could have been done with a commercial franchise. I don't expect Great British Railways to bring big changes - company names may change and the small differences between companies may disappear. AlasdairW (talk) 22:28, 9 May 2026 (UTC)Reply